Monitored house alarm: how to choose Verisure vs Pyronix, Texecom, Risco etc? How are they different? (not DIY)

Jabes

I have a Texecom alarm with Smartcom, and it seems to work just fine.  I did have a Pyronix before, but it would have cost a lot to upgrade and the app had really terrible reviews. I think they have fixed it since mind.

mushii

Please dont try and mix Security Systems and HA control they are two different animals. Alarm systems with Zwave cannot be integrated into an existing Zwave controller - they are not designed like that. Look to buy a good quality alarm system - most now have apps. You can often take a trigger from the panel to activate a Zwave external controller, but dont expect to use the panel to control your Zwave devices.

In answer to the Pyronix app, what is it you want to know? Its pretty basic. Arm / Disarm / Part Arm, Arm Status, Alarm Notification.

VforViennetta

With Texecom, I can connect a Texecom smart plug and link it to the alarm system, to create very basic rules like: switch something on/off when the alarm is armed/disarmed.

Would it be possible to do something similar with Pyronix? Or with Risco? With their own smartplugs or maybe connecting them to third-party hardware?

I remember reading somewhere about someone getting his home automation system to read logs from his alarm, but I don't remember the details.

As for the Pyronix app, just wondering if the user can select which kind of notifications to receive - I understand that, with Texecom, it's the installer that must change these settings on the panel.
Basically both the Pyronix and Texecom apps get such poor review son the app stores that I wonder if they're usable at all.

mushii

The apps are very useable, its more people's expectations. With all of the uncertified 'smart alarm' garbage hitting the market, people want totally un-necessary bells and whistles that these other device offer.

If you want something more than a security system, there is plenty out there. If you want something that is designed to provide security reliably, they are out there too.

IMHO single box hybrid systems (and I have installed the best - Cytech Comfort) you have a single point of failure, that is never good. Plus I do not want my alarm engineer messing around with my Home Automation controls. That is my domain. I do want him to service my alarm and keep it in tip top condition.

Looking at your overall posts, I think that you could do with sitting down with a decent HA Integrator who could give you an overall better strategy for everything that you want to do. I think that you need a good standard alarm system (stand alone with an app) and maybe some form of smart-home hub to look after smart plugs / smart lights etc and a separate camera system. - which is what I would advise any of my clients.

If you are on the subject of basing purchasing decisions based on reviews, have a look at the reviews for the Texecom smart plugs, the general consensus is they would be more suited to fertilizing roses.

VforViennetta

I will be doing a small refurbishment so I will speak to integrators / fitters / etc.  But, in the meanwhile, could you give me any indication on whether / how an alarm system might be connected to some kind of home automation system? I haven't been able to find any information at all.

I'm not looking for anything too fancy, just some very basic rules like switch this on or off when the alarm is armed or disarmed. I will consider my options, but I am afraid a professionally installed HA system might be overkill for something so banal.

Thanks a lot for all your time - I feel I owe you a consultancy fee now!

mushii

Honestly what you want is not hard or expensive. Go with a standard alarm and use something like the Alexa Plus to mange some smart bulbs, like Philips hue and some smart plugs. They can be set up with dusk till dawn or dusk till whatever time to automate them, plus you can just ask her to turn lights / plugs on or off.
If you get an alarm notification you can even ‘drop in’ on your alexa to listen to what is happening.
none of this is hard or complex but a good integrator should be able to help with this.
Echo Plus is currently £99.99 on Black Friday.

VforViennetta

Sorry, I'm afraid I haven't managed to explain myself.

In order to just switch light on or off at certain times I don't need any alarm integration, in fact I don't need any smart anything, a "dumb" timer from Argos would do.

My question is: how can I connect an "integrator" (Alexa / Samsung smart things / Hue etc) to the alarm system, so that something happens (eg switch something on or off) when the alarm is armed or disarmed?

For this to work, the smarth hub/integrator/controller or whatever it's called, must somehow be able to communicate to the alarm system in order to know its status. Otherwise how would Alexa or its equivalent know when the alarm is armed or disarmed?

Is this even possible?

I have found this post Alexa on any alarm about a guy who used a Sonoff smart switch to link his alarm to Alexa. But it's not clear to me if that can only work on unmonitored alarms, and if it would void the insurance and the warranty of the alarm.

ADT Pulse interacts with Alexa but I think that's only in the US.

(That's just an example - I'd never use Alexa. Nor ADT).

mushii

I am so confused. You started talking about professionally installed security systems with CCTV, you have transitioned through ungraded ‘smart alarms,’ and now you are talking about jury-rigging Chinese hardware, that has a reputation for catching fire, into your alarm. You don’t like Alexa and you do not want to use the largest professionally monitored installed alarms company. There maybe somebody out there who has what you want, but in 30 years of doing this, I have not come across them. The specification for a monitored alarm system are pretty rigorous. For me Security is security and HA is HA. My alarm will do similar to what you want but it isn’t monitored, it uses some third party relays and detectors, a home automation hub and was designed by me for my own setup. It is not a commercial solution. Also the HA integration does not impact on the alarm itself as it uses a relay trigger and the two systems are completely isolated.
Let’s go back. What is the problem statement here (what exactly do you want?). And what are the exclusions (what things do you actually not want - eg ADT, Alexa, anything else....)

VforViennetta

OK, let's start again

CCTV - will probably park that for now. Employing a nanny, it probably creates more issues than it solves. Once we'll no longer have a nanny, we may revisit.

Smart plugs: the question is really simple: is there a way to set up some kind of smart plug so that it turns something on or off when the alarm is armed or disarmed? With Texecom it is possible, although their smart plugs are often not considered the most reliable. How about with other brands? Is that possible with a Pyronix or Risco alarm? Possible in a way that doesn't breach the terms of insurance policies and alarm warranties?

Why am I even thinking of this? One option might be to set up a system which turns on certain cameras only when the alarm is armed. We are probably not going to have cameras now because of the nanny, but the nanny won't be with us forever, so I'd like to buy now a system which gives me this possibility in a few years - I don't want to buy a system now and change it after a couple of years.

I don't like ADT because I have had horrible experiences with their customer service. Also, for a property in which I'll be staying for many years, buying the kit upfront and paying a lower monitoring fee can easily work out cheaper, over the medium term, than ADT's model of paying less upfront and more every month.

I don't like Alexa because I don't like Mr Bezos listening into my home and collecting even more data; regardless, I have no need for that if all I want is to just turn something on or off when the system is armed/disarmed.

As for Chinese hardware (the Sonoff switch?), I wasn't saying I want to go down that route, quite the opposite: I meant that the only information I found about connecting a smart home to an alarm seemed dodgy and potentially incompatible with the terms of insurance policies and alarm warranties.

Fabien

I am with @mushii in that you keep Security and HA on separate hardware......however....you can have an alarm with digital / analogue inputs and outputs which can be used to ‘integrate’ with an HA system.

My setup where the alarm streams the logs via an Ethernet connection is based on a Cytech Alarm and my own HA system that understands the alarm log outputs and can make decisions based on this

Fabien