autumn internationals

la gran siete

Most fans are attracted to international rugby in the same way they are not to the club version which they might well view as too parochial.I can quite happily go and watch my local team Worthing Raiders who are now playing in the First Division enjoy the occasion and wish then success but there is no way on earth I would them before my country.One must also bear in mind that the international rugby acts like a window to the sport and success there brings new fans to the sport ,a fact most clubs acknowledge. In New Zealand the attitude is very much of putting the ABs at the very top of the list of priorities and everything is geared towards that, which is probably why their regions have been so successful .Indeed the regions take great pride in numbering ABs amongst their pool of players.I want that situation to be replicated in England and get very pissed off when  i read about certain  fans putting the interest of their clubs before the country we should all be proud of.Even more so the club coaches and owners.Thats why I supported Norths decision to play for Wales and why I supported Saints decision to let him go .Its not as if he was missed as Saints won anyway.I couldn't care less who pays his wages because playing for ones country is the pinnacle of every players ambitions and no club should stand in the way of that.
One way of attracting more fans is by making the sport more attractive.That means letting players express themselves  more freely instead of strictly following some predetermined tactics which are invariably negative and designed to avoid defeat rather than going for a win.Thats what i noticed  about saturdays match , no negativity and thank goodness for G North.Wales got beat because they were  cleaned out at the  breakdown, missed Jonathan Davies and Oz made much better use of the possession they had i.e. quick ball used skilfully. I only wish we had a player such as Q Cooper rather than a robot called Farrell.It hurst admitting that because Oz are England's biggest rival in most sports and I am already dreading the second Ashes test match

Ok the conditions helped a lot but how often have I watched some turgid rubbish served up by two risk averse teams eager to avoid defeat rather than adopting a more positive approach. I also think the rules need to be looked at again and hope the new scrum laws help in that regard.For me there are way too many penalties ,often for mystifying offences which break the flow of a game. They need to change some of those offences into tap and go's or free kicks with the line out throw going to the attacking side to keep the momentum going .That way we can speed the game up and make it more exciting.

A lot of people are put off rugby union because to them its mind numbingly complicated and they have no idea why the ref keeps blowing his whistle.At least watching it on  TV, a commentator can explain why but try explaining them to mate who has never watched rugby live .I tried with my wife and she yawned constantly

BT Bob

I would take issue with use of the word "fans". I would agree that "casual supporters" are, but I think real fans go an watch the game and support a club/region. Maybe I'm being naive.
I'm not sure the NZ comparison works. Firstly, their "clubs" are actually franchises, not clubs in the sense we understand here. Secondly, they have the pick of the South Sea Island players, so many more to choose from. In terms of Club v Country - of course the player would do anything to play for his country (witness Bergamasco a couple of years ago who played scrum half because they were desperate, even though he had a nightmare of a game. Unfortunately, this is now a professional game and who pays the wages does matter. In most cases, it's Clubs/Regions who pay the wages - not the National teams.
One way of attracting more fans is by the "stars" being available to play for their Clubs/Regions more - and spending less time away on International duty. The rest of your comment I agree with completely. Both sides set out to play positive rugby. As a spectacle for the neutral supporter is it was excellent. As an advert for the game it was outstanding. Cooper, when he's on form (as he was on Saturday) is an amazing talent, and a joy to watch.
I don't disagree. Having grown up with it and played for nearly 30 years it's hard to understand how some people don't "get it" - but I take your point.
One thing I think would help my whinging, would be a restructuring of the playing season.
If the Clubs played their respective League matches, then moved up a gear to, for example, the Euro Cup comps, then came the Internationals, this would provide more of a logical progression.
That's it - whinge over

la gran siete

I have been an England fan for decades but have never fully supported a club as i have no passion for any of them unlike i do for my country .I think you'll find many fans think that way, indeed it wasnt so long that club attendance figures were very low whereas international matches always attracted big crowds.I do enjoy watching club matches but only take a real interest in them in as much as they provide the players for England therefore to my mind  everything has to be geared for that purpose.Of course their survival is important but even if they didnt the RFU could set up some regions which could then play the Celtic regions in a new league.There would then be no relegation threat and the players could then develop their skills to a point where they are not afraid of taking risks.If that situation were to come about i would have no problem supporting a region with the proviso that England always comes first.
No, i want more internationals not less because through having more of them the players in the squad will gain a better understanding of each others play .

It doesnt matter whether New Zealand's structure is different to ours ,what matters is they care passionately about their country in the same way many of us here are not about ours .They would never tolerate a situation where their regions  become preeminent and acted entirely  out of their self interest because they paid the wages.Wales, Ireland and Scotland have regions or provinces as well so there should not be an issue with proper player release for internationals ,besides all clubs and such regions should have big enough squads to be able to take account of such situations.I would like to see more second stream internationals involving the Saxons  as well as they provide a vital stepping stone for aspiring plahyers wanting to play at the highest level.

Charlts

The difference is in the structure, in NZ the players are centrally contracted and the season is structured so they're not playing Super 15 games whilst friendly internationals are on. For English clubs, when the Premiership was founded they all agreed not to release players outside of the IRB window. So far it has been followed, indeed Geordan Murphy, Castrogiavanni and many other players have missed out on caps because of it. Leicester were threatened with points being docked the last time this came up. Norths employers have agreed to it to stop the star names (assets the premiership own) aren't away drawing money for somebody else. Let's not forget Gloucester could be punished as well for releasing Qera.

Personally if I'm going to watch live Rugby in the Autumn, I'll walk over Welford Road to South Leicester, or go into town and watch the Tigers, if I'm building a weekend around watching Rugby away from home I'd rather go to Sandy Park than Twickenham for a friendly. I'm no fan of watching friendlies they're basically a jolly, I'd much rather watch a meaningful 6N game than an AI. Whilst the international calendar over laps the clubs and is administrated so poorly for the northern hemisphere I'm not fussed by it. Will this summers first test against the Kiwis be much cop whilst the best players are still at home playing in the Premiership final?

la gran siete

Well bess it was finally agreed after years of wrangling between between the premiership and the RFU , fact which prevented England making any progress on the international front.Absolutely infuriating for any England fan.Fact is Saints suffered not one iota from releasing North and kept him happy in the process . Clubs should have large enough squads to absorb any absenteeism and if too much is at stake with each club game then maybe its time to look to restructuring the premiership by ring fencing it and only allowing the most viable clubs to take part.I believe by doing that the players will be encouraged to play without fear of making mistakes and therefore be prepared to develop the kind of "outrageous skills" we saw from Q Cooper, for they would surely entertain the crowds There is far too much turgid rubbish in the AP with some notable exceptions ,last saturday's match and Sandy park being one.
AI matches are neither friendlies nor meaningless .They are about how far England have developed in relation to the major SH sides and also about pride.Try telling the ABs the AIs are meaningless.I enjoyed all three matches England played albeit in patches and use them to look for signs of improvement.Clearly the forwards have done so but the backs have some way to go,hardly surprising with a robot at 10 a 12 who is afraid to offload and a 13 who should go back to RL